Is Social Media a Good Source for Financial Advice with Hanna Morrell - 160

[00:00:00] Welcome to Money Talk with Skyler Fleming, where talking about money is encouraged. Let's get talking!

[00:00:06] Welcome, Money Buddies, to this week's episode of Money Talk with Skyler Fleming.

[00:00:10] Today we're tackling whether or not social media is a good source for financial advice.

[00:00:14] Does it only create FOMO and lead to people getting scammed, or are there ways you can get good financial advice from the internet?

[00:00:19] I certainly think there are some good ways to get good financial advice from the internet,

[00:00:23] and I'm going to detail more in one of the money talking points later in this episode.

[00:00:26] But I am excited for this money talk today. This has been a topic that I've been wanting to talk about for quite a while.

[00:00:31] Quick update though, I've been sending out regular emails with even more information about each of the money talking points every week.

[00:00:37] Those can be a great tool to screenshot or forward to your friend to start a money talk.

[00:00:41] Head over to the show notes and find the link to sign up for my email list.

[00:00:44] But let's keep moving on with today's money buddy.

[00:00:46] Today's money buddy is Hanna Morrell.

[00:00:48] Hanna is a holistic, trauma-informed financial coach, and like many of her clients,

[00:00:52] she turned to the financial services world, read countless books, and searched everywhere online for financial advice.

[00:00:59] Doing everything she could to learn how to make sound decisions with her money and finally get her financial life in order.

[00:01:04] However, time and time again, she was met with life insurance sales pitches,

[00:01:08] unrealistic strategies that didn't fit her circumstances,

[00:01:11] and messages that only reinforced what she already feared.

[00:01:13] That she was somehow bad at managing money.

[00:01:16] She now uses this understanding to help people trust themselves again with their money.

[00:01:19] The money talking points for this week are,

[00:01:22] How can you find good financial advice on the internet?

[00:01:24] Two, what is a good piece of financial advice that you learned online?

[00:01:28] And three, what is a bad piece of financial advice that took a while to learn that it was bad?

[00:01:33] With the money talking points in mind, let's get talking.

[00:01:45] Hello everyone and welcome to today's interview on Money Talk with Skylar Fleming.

[00:01:49] Joining me today I have Hanna Morrell and I'm excited to talk about social media today.

[00:01:54] Hanna, before we get into this, could you introduce yourself to everyone?

[00:01:56] Hi folks, my name is Hanna Morrell.

[00:01:58] I'm a holistic, trauma-informed financial coach with Pacific Stoa and yourbirthcoach.com.

[00:02:05] Fantastic.

[00:02:05] I'm really excited to have this conversation about social media.

[00:02:08] It's been in the back of my mind for quite a while.

[00:02:11] So one of the main things, I found an article online and it said,

[00:02:14] social media can potentially lead to envy, romanticizing unattainable goals, and exposure to faulty advice.

[00:02:21] So kicking it off, maybe with that envy piece, how can social media lead to FOMO when it comes to our financial advice?

[00:02:28] So there's about a thousand different ways that this can happen.

[00:02:32] The first one related to FOMO directly is the idea of something that our brains do called loss aversion.

[00:02:38] Our brains are super keen not to lose out on anything, which means that sometimes we interpret things as a loss that aren't really a loss.

[00:02:47] That's kind of the heart and soul of FOMO.

[00:02:50] So we have that loss aversion motivating us to do things.

[00:02:53] This is not a personality defect and it's not a choice.

[00:02:56] It's just something that's sort of built into our heads.

[00:02:58] If you add to that our brains seeking connection, we are a social creature.

[00:03:05] Oh my God.

[00:03:06] We're social critters.

[00:03:07] We take our cues for what is acceptable from being part of the in-group.

[00:03:12] And today, part of that means social media.

[00:03:14] Even if we know at the front part of our brain that some of what we're seeing is fiction,

[00:03:18] it can be very difficult to tell our brains that this isn't probably real, right?

[00:03:23] Keeping up with the Joneses is what we've kind of been told that this is before and it's way deeper than that.

[00:03:29] When we see part of a group, we see safety, right?

[00:03:33] This goes all the way back to the way our brains are developed.

[00:03:36] Safety groups are safety.

[00:03:38] So we want to be part of those in-groups.

[00:03:40] And we do lots of things from our beauty standards to our body standards to what we eat to our money.

[00:03:45] We can sometimes be heavily motivated by being seen as part of the group.

[00:03:51] Failure to meet those standards is something that we will often internalize as shame, right?

[00:03:57] Like what's wrong with me?

[00:03:58] And we, of course, will try to resolve shame at all costs.

[00:04:02] That trying to resolve that shame of ourselves will often mean that we end up buying into programs,

[00:04:08] scams, services systems that might not actually be serving us.

[00:04:12] Those are just my top two things right off the top of my head,

[00:04:16] like our tendency towards a loss aversion and our tendency to desire connection and being part of a group,

[00:04:21] which is very real for us.

[00:04:23] Yeah.

[00:04:23] There's a large group out there right now that's making themselves known as people who bought Bitcoin.

[00:04:27] And that's where my FOMO comes in on social media.

[00:04:30] That's what kind of got this brewing for me.

[00:04:31] It's heading on its path back up.

[00:04:33] How do we maybe cope with that as we see it kind of bombarding us?

[00:04:37] First of all, be aware that it's happening.

[00:04:39] What we're seeing on social media isn't truly healthy financial resilience.

[00:04:44] It is the outward expression of prosperity.

[00:04:47] Sometimes incredibly toxic positivity is something our brains want to fall for.

[00:04:53] The awareness that scams and bad financial advice happen can help us to be aware.

[00:04:58] That's probably my first instinct.

[00:05:00] Yeah, we need to be aware of it.

[00:05:02] That starting point, because that's what's kept me out of jumping onto those Bitcoin FOMO ships.

[00:05:07] I'm aware that that's what I'm going through.

[00:05:09] I'm not doing like investment analysis and things like that and coming to the conclusion that it's a good buy.

[00:05:16] I'm coming to the conclusion that I want to buy it because others are.

[00:05:19] So being aware, that's what's stopping me.

[00:05:21] How do we be more aware of that faulty advice?

[00:05:24] You mentioned most of it's probably a scam.

[00:05:26] It's just good things getting posted out there.

[00:05:31] I think one good way to do that is to recognize, and this goes for all parts of our lives,

[00:05:36] understand the distinction between emotional decision-making and decision-making that includes emotion.

[00:05:41] So emotional decision is that super fast, super reactive, knee-jerk reaction that you're kind of talking about.

[00:05:48] Like FOMO is right in there.

[00:05:50] FOMO is an emotional decision.

[00:05:52] And we are compelled to do all sorts of things.

[00:05:55] Instead, what I work on with my own clients is decision-making that includes emotion.

[00:06:02] We're not going to eliminate emotions from our decision-making.

[00:06:05] Emotions are tools.

[00:06:07] Decision-making that includes emotion is typically slower.

[00:06:11] It includes more emotion.

[00:06:13] So we're not just solving for one thing.

[00:06:15] We typically have a little bit more time to be thoughtful.

[00:06:18] And that time, that slowness in our decision-making,

[00:06:20] I'm not talking about taking 10 weeks to make a decision.

[00:06:23] I'm talking sometimes, especially with spending decisions, it's like 15 seconds.

[00:06:28] But recognizing when you're in that emotional decision-making space,

[00:06:32] when you're making a super, super fast decision,

[00:06:35] one huge hallmark of an emotional decision is that it feels good to make that decision.

[00:06:40] It scratches an itch in our heads.

[00:06:42] So if you find that that's where you're making decisions from,

[00:06:45] especially based on something you've heard on social media,

[00:06:49] if it feels like you're scratching that itch,

[00:06:50] that may be an emotional decision.

[00:06:53] And that may be your indicator to slow yourself down just a little bit.

[00:06:57] It doesn't take much for our brains to get back on track with

[00:07:00] including different emotions into our decision-making.

[00:07:03] Yeah, I think that's perfect.

[00:07:04] We can be aware by understanding emotion will be there.

[00:07:07] And I really like what you're saying that you can often recognize emotion as if

[00:07:11] it's something that's trying to make you feel good.

[00:07:13] Once you recognize that and you're able to take, like you said, that 15 seconds

[00:07:16] just to think about it and realize, hey, this is emotionally driven and not necessarily

[00:07:21] goal-driven or what I really want to do with my money.

[00:07:24] How have you seen people benefit in their life?

[00:07:27] Like the people you coach, have you seen people benefit from

[00:07:29] maybe taking a pause to think about the emotion?

[00:07:32] I work with individuals, women, and a lot of couples.

[00:07:35] You can imagine with couples, not only do we each have our own internal relationships

[00:07:39] with money, but now we have like another relationship added onto that.

[00:07:43] So that gets very complex very quickly.

[00:07:45] And any time we can put a little distance between ourself, the impetus to do a thing

[00:07:50] and the doing of the thing, and that could mean buying Bitcoin.

[00:07:54] It could be signing up for a program, but it could also mean our own tone of voice,

[00:07:59] posture, word choice, anything like that.

[00:08:02] And getting that little tiny bit of slowness helps with our self-awareness.

[00:08:06] And what we're after specifically is self-awareness without judgment.

[00:08:11] I don't have to teach anybody how to be self-aware with judgment.

[00:08:13] Everybody's good at that.

[00:08:15] But self-awareness without judgment, especially in the financial sense,

[00:08:19] helps us find patterns in our behavior.

[00:08:22] Let's call back to social media.

[00:08:24] So let's say I notice a pattern in my behavior that I'm really attracted to social media influencers

[00:08:31] talking about has-hacking.

[00:08:32] And I gave some of my credit card information, didn't get anything of value back from that.

[00:08:38] I'm noticing a pattern in my behavior that this is really important to me for some reason.

[00:08:43] Once you recognize the pattern, the idea is not to punish yourself, correct yourself,

[00:08:47] shut yourself down, teach yourself a lesson.

[00:08:49] The idea is to interrupt that pattern in a gentle way.

[00:08:53] An interruption is all we're after.

[00:08:55] Using that pattern as an indicator.

[00:08:57] Here's what I can do instead.

[00:08:59] Instead, I can slow myself down a little bit, reach out for connection.

[00:09:02] I know you talk a lot about talking about money, Skylar, which is absolutely, thank you for doing this.

[00:09:08] This is important, right?

[00:09:09] Feeling connected in our real world lives and our online lives probably makes it less likely

[00:09:15] that we're going to feel the need to unpack with that kind of desperation around social media messaging.

[00:09:21] Yeah.

[00:09:21] And I want to talk about that pattern recognition you mentioned.

[00:09:24] What do you think about using that as a jumping off point, taking the social media advice and recognizing,

[00:09:30] hey, my algorithm is serving me house hacking reels and shorts like crazy.

[00:09:34] This is something I'm interested in.

[00:09:36] Like you said, how can we benefit or even take that step to find someone who can really help us

[00:09:42] instead of just these influencers that are selling courses?

[00:09:45] I think as you're listening to the media that you're consuming, if there's a lot of certainty and a lot of urgency

[00:09:51] and sometimes using words and terminology that we don't understand, if you're noticing that happening a lot,

[00:09:57] there's the pattern recognition.

[00:09:59] Take some time and deeply understand the terms that they're using.

[00:10:02] What does that term actually mean?

[00:10:04] If you can break that down for yourself and explain the core concepts to somebody else,

[00:10:10] like the old saying is if you can't explain it to your grandma.

[00:10:13] It's not a good idea.

[00:10:15] Yeah.

[00:10:15] It's not a good idea, right?

[00:10:17] So breaking down those terms and making sure that you understand,

[00:10:20] educating yourself as you go instead of just accepting.

[00:10:24] Well, we love social proof.

[00:10:26] That's why podcasts need reviews.

[00:10:28] It's because we need social proof.

[00:10:31] That's important to us.

[00:10:32] But just accepting that social proof carte blanche can be super damaging.

[00:10:37] Understanding the terminology is probably the next step on top of that.

[00:10:41] Then the next step would be starting an actual conversation,

[00:10:45] finding somebody who is actually doing that.

[00:10:48] If you can find that in real life, that's fantastic.

[00:10:51] Let's say you reach out to an influencer and you're starting a conversation with them

[00:10:54] to ask more questions and to learn more.

[00:10:56] And they come back with, here's my bundle, right?

[00:11:00] Here's my program.

[00:11:01] That might not be exactly what you're needing.

[00:11:04] They're not meeting you where you are.

[00:11:07] If the information is free but ends in a sales pitch,

[00:11:10] that's a pretty good indicator that that's somebody who is very good at making money that way.

[00:11:15] Nothing wrong with making money, but it might not be right.

[00:11:17] You've got to be aware of the motive.

[00:11:18] Yes.

[00:11:19] And it might not be right for you, right?

[00:11:21] If you're needing more, ask for what you need.

[00:11:24] And I like the be aware of the motive.

[00:11:25] If everything they're trying to do is like undersigned with a click here to buy kind of

[00:11:30] thing, then you should be aware of that.

[00:11:32] But if you do reach out and they're responding to your questions,

[00:11:35] that might be a perfect person to build some rapport with,

[00:11:37] build a conversation with and get their advice.

[00:11:39] Maybe they do still ultimately have some sort of promotion,

[00:11:43] but there can be a balance between that.

[00:11:45] There are good social media influencers out there.

[00:11:47] Not everyone's trying to scam you out of money.

[00:11:50] But one thing that I'm thinking of that my audience tends to be young adults

[00:11:54] and that's who we're trying to speak to.

[00:11:56] They got a long time that their money still can grow and work for them.

[00:12:00] Maybe they're getting caught in this bad financial advice from social media.

[00:12:04] How can that impact them in the long term and lead to long term problems?

[00:12:08] We get this financial advice and we've all gotten garbage financial advice.

[00:12:12] We're bathed in good and bad.

[00:12:14] When we get financial advice, when we are young, that advice tends to compound on itself

[00:12:20] because we've internalized it.

[00:12:22] We don't really remember how we got that little piece of advice, but we have accepted that as

[00:12:27] truth and then we continue to expect ourselves to meet that expectation.

[00:12:31] The natural, although almost never immediate result of taking bad financial advice is,

[00:12:36] of course, those negative outcomes.

[00:12:38] And because of that delay, it's really difficult for us to understand cause and effect.

[00:12:43] If the negative outcomes were immediate, our brains would go, oh, that's the problem right there.

[00:12:48] But because the delay is so long, we've made so many other changes.

[00:12:52] Sometimes it's really difficult to unpick what particular piece of advice,

[00:12:57] especially for young folks who have long lines ahead of them.

[00:13:01] It can be really difficult to appreciate just which piece of advice you should be evaluating

[00:13:06] that didn't work for you because there's just been so many and they kind of rolled on to each other.

[00:13:11] With social media, you're only getting these small snippets of advice.

[00:13:14] You're not getting the whole picture.

[00:13:16] An example is maybe someone's recommending you to use credit card balance transfers, for example,

[00:13:21] as a way to reduce some of your debt because maybe there is a promotion

[00:13:25] and maybe there is a way for that to actually be beneficial for you,

[00:13:29] but you don't realize the 3% fee up front because that wasn't in their snippet.

[00:13:33] Now you're six or seven balance transfers into your debt payoff journey,

[00:13:37] wondering why it isn't getting any lower because you missed that one piece of info.

[00:13:40] So like you said, you don't know where that advice initially came from

[00:13:43] because it was just one of those reels that you swiped through.

[00:13:46] But in the long term, that can have several hundred thousands of dollars impact on you.

[00:13:51] That can be really challenging to balance.

[00:13:53] Like you said, that timeframe is difficult.

[00:13:54] How do we bring it back to that?

[00:13:56] How do we recognize where that advice comes from?

[00:13:59] Do you think turning to others and asking questions to them might be helpful?

[00:14:03] Theoretically, great.

[00:14:03] But unfortunately, with finances and money, they've kind of, all of us in our culture,

[00:14:10] kind of been told that there's one correct way to do money.

[00:14:13] So if you ask your Uncle John the one correct way to do money, he's going to have one correct way.

[00:14:17] And then you ask somebody else on social media what their correct way is,

[00:14:20] they have one correct way.

[00:14:21] And there is no one correct way to do money.

[00:14:24] That's why what we do is holistic.

[00:14:27] Holistic just means every single part of your life touches your finances,

[00:14:30] and finances touches every single part of your life.

[00:14:33] So really what we end up doing is frantically trying to cobble together all these correct ways

[00:14:39] that we've been told to do money and keep trying to comply over and over again

[00:14:44] with these different philosophies, systems, that kind of a thing.

[00:14:48] And I know that you've seen this in the work that you do.

[00:14:50] As many of those messaging messages that we get from social media and otherwise is negative, right?

[00:14:56] It's based on like you're doing it wrong.

[00:14:58] Shame.

[00:14:59] Shame is huge.

[00:15:01] Like I mentioned at the top, what we do is consider trauma-informed.

[00:15:05] And one of the biggest things that we see around financial trauma,

[00:15:08] one of the single biggest indicators that we use,

[00:15:11] is that there's a bunch of shame around that.

[00:15:13] I did everything I was supposed to do, right?

[00:15:16] I did the balance transfers.

[00:15:17] The balance transfers everything.

[00:15:18] I did what I was supposed to do and it's not working.

[00:15:21] Instead of thinking maybe that was a bad tool,

[00:15:23] maybe that was a bad piece of advice,

[00:15:26] we end up evaluating ourselves.

[00:15:27] I did everything I was supposed to do.

[00:15:29] It's not working.

[00:15:30] What's wrong with me?

[00:15:31] Shame is a fantastic indicator that we might have internalized some of this bad message.

[00:15:36] There's indicators out there.

[00:15:37] Like you said, shame's one of them.

[00:15:39] Recognizing those patterns of repeated content on social media,

[00:15:42] maybe a feeling of guilt around your spending is another indicator that there's a pattern you need to address.

[00:15:48] Social media does have quite a few bad things out there when it comes to financial advice,

[00:15:53] but it can also be good.

[00:15:54] How has social media maybe opened up their conversation for people to help them find those other ways to do money?

[00:15:59] You're a great example of that.

[00:16:01] There's a lot of really lovely financial advice.

[00:16:04] And the good financial advice I'm seeing is coming from,

[00:16:08] and I'm saying this as a person in my 50s, from young people.

[00:16:12] And by that, I mean anybody on the edge of court.

[00:16:15] Is that younger generations seem to be tolerating the shame-based stuff a whole lot less than my generation or the boomers certainly did.

[00:16:24] They don't like to be directed, so they end up not directing, correcting, or shaming others.

[00:16:29] There is just a bunch of great financial advice out there, but you kind of have to curate that for yourself.

[00:16:35] You need to be able to understand what's good and what's not good.

[00:16:38] And essentially, that breaks down to, is that serving you?

[00:16:41] If a system is trying to comply with you and your life, then that's probably going to work a whole lot better.

[00:16:48] There's the interconnectedness of this too.

[00:16:51] We are more likely to talk about money than ever before.

[00:16:55] We all know there's a couple domains of our lives that we're not supposed to talk about.

[00:16:59] An interesting sort of equivalence happens in our heads.

[00:17:03] Back to shame, and I didn't mean to be talking about shame the whole time, but I think this is deeply important.

[00:17:08] It's very important when it comes to our money.

[00:17:09] I like it.

[00:17:10] People don't realize how much of it is present in our lives when it comes to spending.

[00:17:15] Like if you get that credit card statement in the mail, maybe it's a little bit influenced to make you feel bad, and then you go spend more money.

[00:17:21] I don't know.

[00:17:21] There's a lot of ways that shame plays a role that if we're not aware, it can have a big impact on our money.

[00:17:27] But what were you going to say about shame?

[00:17:28] We hide things that we are shamed of, and we are told to hide our money.

[00:17:33] We don't talk about stuff we're ashamed of, so we're told not to talk about our money,

[00:17:36] and our brains automatically think this is something to be ashamed of.

[00:17:40] And that is extremely isolating, and that is absolutely the opposite of what we want, right?

[00:17:45] We want interconnectedness.

[00:17:48] Interconnectedness means that we're safe.

[00:17:50] We're part of this group.

[00:17:51] So I adore that new social media and new things happening, that there's more connectedness between people talking about money in a healthy way.

[00:18:01] That can only help.

[00:18:03] That acceptance, that safety, that interconnectedness is healthy for our brains.

[00:18:08] It's healthy for our money.

[00:18:10] When we're in a safe place talking with safe people, we can gather new ideas and be open instead of feeling like we are constantly failing.

[00:18:18] There's one person listening right now that I know has some sort of deep burning question in their mind about money.

[00:18:24] How can that person benefit from having open and transparent financial conversations with other people?

[00:18:29] First of all, it's going to take some bravery, right?

[00:18:32] Starting those conversations feels kind of like it's a topic, right?

[00:18:36] I'm not exaggerating.

[00:18:38] Like our brains have been told to not talk about finances.

[00:18:42] And we don't talk about things like accountability.

[00:18:44] We don't do accountability buddies in our work.

[00:18:47] We talk about something called a champion.

[00:18:49] And that would be to seek out somebody who is accepting of you, who wants the very best for you, who, of course, you want to spend a little more time with, asks open-ended questions, wants more information from you, and wouldn't judge you for anything that's going on.

[00:19:03] And to open a dialogue with that person.

[00:19:05] So if you're the person that's got to be talking about, I know that you probably have in your brain somebody who you want to spend more time with, who accepts you regardless, who maybe isn't an expert on money either, but together the two of you can be each other's champions.

[00:19:18] And begin to start small, of course, in a way that is comfortable for both of you.

[00:19:23] And that's really all that it takes.

[00:19:25] It doesn't need to be a support group.

[00:19:27] It can just be you and one other person.

[00:19:30] In real life, online, it doesn't really matter to find a connection, a safe place.

[00:19:34] And then to hold yourself and that other person to that boundary.

[00:19:39] If it's not safe, then that's not the person to be talking about money around.

[00:19:44] You can find these podcast episodes that one of you likes, share it with the other, and you have a money talk about it.

[00:19:50] There's a lot of great resources out there that as you're sharing them amongst each other, you're going to find new ideas.

[00:19:55] Like I all the time will send them.

[00:19:57] I listen to money podcasts all the time.

[00:19:58] It's just in my blood because of what I do.

[00:20:00] And I'll send them to my wife and be like, hey, we need to listen to this one on our next drive.

[00:20:04] You can do that with your friend.

[00:20:06] You can do that with a spouse, your champion, as you call them.

[00:20:09] I like to call my community the money buddies.

[00:20:11] And you can send them to each other and then you have a conversation about what you're learning.

[00:20:16] How can new ideas be fostered through these open conversations that you're having with each other?

[00:20:21] Safety, which I talked about at length.

[00:20:23] I think curiosity is maybe the single biggest thing.

[00:20:27] Being open and being curious solves a lot of problems.

[00:20:30] Asking questions like tell me more about that.

[00:20:32] Not interrogating, but asking those good open-ended questions.

[00:20:36] And then, of course, like in your podcast, you ask the questions.

[00:20:40] Here are your prompts for your money talk.

[00:20:42] Using strong prompts like that I think is absolutely fantastic.

[00:20:45] That that could start the conversation.

[00:20:47] That might otherwise mean like you and your buddy sitting down at coffee going, okay, you go.

[00:20:53] But having those prompts available, super, super good.

[00:20:56] One of them I heard on your podcast not too long ago was the question, what was your first money memory?

[00:21:03] I think that is powerful.

[00:21:05] That question could dredge up some financial trauma.

[00:21:08] So just be aware that that might be awesome.

[00:21:11] Yeah, it's a goldmine.

[00:21:12] That question will unleash everything.

[00:21:14] All sorts of things.

[00:21:15] But I think that is a brilliant question.

[00:21:18] I think that storytelling is an undervalued piece of connection that we can deal with and for each other just telling each other our stories.

[00:21:28] So if that's all you and your champion do is tell each other your money stories, it will open up that curiosity.

[00:21:34] What's your first money memory question?

[00:21:36] It's crazy what you're going to learn about people because you're often going to identify something.

[00:21:40] Like the one that I often share is that I would usually be sent into the gas station with a $20 bill for my parents to get gas.

[00:21:47] And that would lead me now to always want to make sure I have enough money to fill the car.

[00:21:52] Whether with a debit card or credit card, I want to make sure that I always have enough money that I'm putting in whatever I need.

[00:21:58] So and that's expands to so many other areas of my life of making sure to have a savings behind me to back me up.

[00:22:04] So yeah, that's a great one to ask your friends about.

[00:22:06] Let's move into tools a little bit here.

[00:22:08] Once people have realized social media is feeding them bad advice or maybe they've curated it to a little bit of better advice, what's their next steps after they realize that bad advice is there?

[00:22:18] I would say, first of all, unfollowing the folks that have burned you in, curating better.

[00:22:23] Like we talked about looking for this pattern, looking for the commonalities so you know what's important to you.

[00:22:29] And I would also say probably really focusing on not punishing yourself or anybody else.

[00:22:34] You said curating, looking specifically for people, accounts, influencers who meet a couple requirements.

[00:22:42] People who have a messaging of respecting who you are right now.

[00:22:46] Not like you need to do this so that you could be this or you should be this.

[00:22:51] People in accounts who are teaching you how to trust yourself, not reinforcing that you cannot be trusted.

[00:22:57] Positivity is great, but toxic positivity is not great.

[00:23:00] If you're feeling good, energized, uplifted, organized after talking with a person or listening to, you know, intaking somebody's media and that there's boundaries that are not overstepped.

[00:23:11] I would probably say that one of the, and we haven't really talked about this, is to understand like, is this person's content in line with my values?

[00:23:21] So maybe that's the next best step is to understand what are my values, right?

[00:23:27] To begin to understand deeply like, what are my values for my money, which is going to be, what are my values for my entire life?

[00:23:34] And that's sort of evaluating the media that you take in accordance with those values.

[00:23:41] Yeah, it's fantastic.

[00:23:42] I love when we just lay out lists and to those listening, you don't have to take every single one that we suggested, find the one that works for you.

[00:23:48] Maybe that values one clicked in your mind.

[00:23:50] You're like, yes, I need to identify some of my values for money.

[00:23:53] And like you said, values for life, because money touches everything in our life.

[00:23:57] There's really no way around it.

[00:23:59] So we have to talk about it and keep it going.

[00:24:01] What tools or what do you do to help people understand those values, if that is the one they want to continue down?

[00:24:07] There's lots of good value assessors.

[00:24:10] Like you can, there's tons and tons of like those free quizzes that you can take that can help you understand your values.

[00:24:15] One of the best ways is to understand what your values are not.

[00:24:18] What is not important?

[00:24:19] What do you want to eliminate from your life?

[00:24:22] Anti-value?

[00:24:23] I don't know.

[00:24:23] There's probably better for life with that.

[00:24:25] So honesty, let's say, is a very easy way to start.

[00:24:29] You want to be an honest person and then get curious about that.

[00:24:33] Okay, what is related to honesty that is also important to me?

[00:24:36] Doing what I say I'm going to do.

[00:24:38] Trying to be as consistent as possible.

[00:24:40] Nobody is perfectly consistent.

[00:24:42] It's a value we all have.

[00:24:43] It's deeply important to us, but nobody is consistent.

[00:24:47] But sort of understanding those values.

[00:24:48] So like if you understand like as consistent as possible is important to you and then you're interacting with somebody who's flighty, then you kind of know that that's something valuable to you that is not being met there.

[00:25:02] So I wish I had like a tool to just provide to you.

[00:25:06] There are some out there, I'm sure.

[00:25:07] Tons of free ones.

[00:25:08] Quizzes to get you started and then you can have a little bit of a deeper thought through them.

[00:25:13] That's a great way to get started.

[00:25:15] What are some other tools that you recommend to people when it comes to finding good financial advice or how you help your clients and people you're coaching and things like that?

[00:25:23] And I know I'm repeating myself here, but the first one would be to make sure that you have an understanding of the terminology that's being used.

[00:25:29] Very often people who have bad intentions are going to use a lot of big terminology, big words.

[00:25:35] This is not just as simple as financial literacy or understanding terms.

[00:25:40] This is understanding the concepts underlying them.

[00:25:43] Through that knowledge work, we can find out what works for us and what doesn't.

[00:25:48] And in that knowledge work, more than just like being able to regurgitate, like what is an EFT?

[00:25:56] Just be like, what's the difference between a stock and a bond?

[00:25:59] That's great, but that's never changed anybody's life.

[00:26:02] Leverage your own curiosity over and over again.

[00:26:05] As you're learning, be curious and really just revel in your curiosity, which we're all, we're curious weirdos, all of us humans.

[00:26:14] Leverage that, get curious, ask questions and stay open and connected.

[00:26:19] I had an episode a couple of weeks ago where Dana Miranda and I talked about blanket advice.

[00:26:24] And I've been thinking about it throughout this whole episode.

[00:26:26] So I wanted to plug it for people to go back to and listen to.

[00:26:28] Yes.

[00:26:29] It's one about blanket advice where we talk about how so many people try to just give this one size, tries to fit all advice.

[00:26:35] And she argues that the whole point is to make sure you understand what you're using.

[00:26:40] She's like, payday loans may not be a bad option if you understand what they are and you're in that kind of a situation.

[00:26:45] As long as you understand the cost.

[00:26:47] All fancy jargon is usually the sign of bad social media advice, of a system that's trying to lock you in instead of systems that are trying to help you.

[00:26:56] So that I think is a great place to leave this episode, kind of wrap it up with awareness overall.

[00:27:01] How can people find you online or get connected with you?

[00:27:04] So I'm going to make a special landing page for your listeners.

[00:27:07] What do you call them?

[00:27:08] Money buddies?

[00:27:09] Yes.

[00:27:09] So let's do yourworthcoach.com slash talk.

[00:27:13] And that will be specifically for you folks.

[00:27:15] I will have a quiz there, like how financially healthy are you?

[00:27:19] Yeah, I'll have that quiz there for them.

[00:27:21] If you think it's appropriate to gather, I'll include some recorded classes on financial trauma.

[00:27:26] I think any material as people keep looking around would be good.

[00:27:29] Yeah, I'll throw those resources in there.

[00:27:31] That'll be available to your folks.

[00:27:34] Fantastic.

[00:27:35] There we go.

[00:27:36] There will be a link in the show notes, of course.

[00:27:38] So go over there and find that and you can head over to her page.

[00:27:42] But one final question.

[00:27:43] I'd like to ask everyone something similar to this.

[00:27:45] If you could go back to your early 20s and give yourself some sort of financial tool to focus on, what would it be?

[00:27:52] I love this question.

[00:27:53] It is awful.

[00:27:54] It's hard.

[00:27:56] But I do love it so much.

[00:27:58] I would go back to myself in my 20s and tell myself that there is no one correct way to do money.

[00:28:04] I was brought up that you only spend on your needs and not what you want, right?

[00:28:08] The wants versus needs thing as a decision-making strategy is garbage and you can throw it away.

[00:28:13] There's financial tools should be simple, not simplistic.

[00:28:17] A lot of what you've discovered with social media is simplistic, including wants versus needs,

[00:28:23] which is what I would tell my 20-year-old self to get rid of that.

[00:28:26] Forget about it.

[00:28:26] Yeah.

[00:28:27] Yeah.

[00:28:27] I love that.

[00:28:28] There's so many ways to do money and that's a fantastic place to leave this on.

[00:28:32] There's hundreds of my podcast episodes before this.

[00:28:34] There's hundreds of other podcasts all sharing so many great different ideas.

[00:28:38] But that's going to do it for today's interview.

[00:28:40] Hannah, thank you so much for joining us.

[00:28:42] It's been a great conversation.

[00:28:43] Thank you so much for having me.

[00:28:53] Thank you so much to Hannah Morrell for coming on today's episode.

[00:28:56] And let's jump right here into the first money talking point.

[00:29:00] How can you find good financial advice on the internet?

[00:29:03] Well, I turn to podcasts a lot.

[00:29:06] Obviously, since I'm doing a podcast, I tend to love them.

[00:29:08] But that's my main source for financial info.

[00:29:11] Honestly, I would avoid short form content and I would avoid making that your primary source for financial information because it's so easy to create hype clickbait with short form content.

[00:29:21] And short form content can tend to not be able to include enough information to help you actually make a sound decision when it comes to your finances.

[00:29:30] All of the podcast shows and such out there, including mine, are putting out content in a short form method.

[00:29:35] But that is to direct you to the longer form content that is going to give you enough information.

[00:29:39] From my perspective, I think you need to be careful when observing short form content and when you're taking financial advice from it.

[00:29:45] Since it's, like I said, easy to put out clickbait hype content that doesn't have a lot of value.

[00:29:49] Longer form shows and YouTube videos require so much research.

[00:29:52] The people you are watching put in a lot of work into the content they're making.

[00:29:56] I put many hours into each podcast episode.

[00:29:59] The quality, depth, and length of the content you're consuming on the internet is going to help you know if it's good or not.

[00:30:04] So if it's a short 30 second to a minute video, those are easy to make.

[00:30:08] Like I do a Money Talk Monday every week on social media.

[00:30:11] Those are a whole lot faster for me to make.

[00:30:12] And though they can provide good content, you're going to find the best financial advice from the longer form content.

[00:30:18] Here are some recommendations that I have for you to go and check out.

[00:30:20] It's likely that you've heard of some of these, but if you haven't, let them know you came from Skylar and that you checked them out from my podcast.

[00:30:26] A couple ones.

[00:30:28] How to Money.

[00:30:29] They were on my show back in episode 104, Stacking Benjamins.

[00:30:32] I was on Stacking Benjamins a while back.

[00:30:34] I'll link to that show in my show notes if you want to get started with that one.

[00:30:37] The Money Guy Show.

[00:30:38] And I think this one is often a graduation point for any Dave Ramsey listeners.

[00:30:41] So if you like Dave Ramsey, it's time to graduate and move on to the Money Guy Show.

[00:30:46] Choose a five.

[00:30:47] And then those are really my four main favorite shows that I like to listen to all the time.

[00:30:51] I have more that I listen to.

[00:30:53] And if you need some recommendations, schedule a quick money chat and let's talk about some other podcasts or shoot me an email.

[00:30:57] The second money talking point is what is a good piece of financial advice that you learned online?

[00:31:02] Well, investing in ETFs and index funds is something that I learned from the internet.

[00:31:06] And it's honestly probably going to completely change my wife and I's lives forever.

[00:31:11] The reason it's going to change our life is because previously I was going by the stock picking advice that all the apps out there were leading us to believe is the way to go.

[00:31:18] When you try to pick stocks, it's going to be very hard to find a solid return.

[00:31:21] And I'm so happy that I learned how great it is to just be the market instead of trying to beat the market.

[00:31:26] So I can easily just funnel as much money as possible into the S&P 500 or a total stock market index ETF and keep my investing simple.

[00:31:34] It's the greatest thing I've ever learned from the internet.

[00:31:35] It saved my wife and I so much stress.

[00:31:37] I used to bombard my wife with all these great investing ideas and tactics that were just garbage and honestly probably wouldn't have got us nearly anywhere as close to as just simple index fund ETF investing.

[00:31:48] So what's something you've learned online?

[00:31:49] Send me a quick email, hit reply to any of my newsletters that you get, or head over to the show notes and click on my email and let me know the greatest piece of financial advice you got from the internet.

[00:31:59] But let's move on to the third money talking point here.

[00:32:01] What is a bad piece of financial advice that took you a while to learn that it was bad?

[00:32:05] For me, it was the strict adherence to no credit cards at all.

[00:32:08] The Dave Ramsey advice of no credit cards at all is frankly not good for people.

[00:32:13] It's not good for everybody.

[00:32:14] And he is like kind of the figure of blanket advice.

[00:32:17] The better advice is to figure out what works for you.

[00:32:20] Credit cards might not work for you and they might drive you to spend more money.

[00:32:24] And that means you need to avoid them.

[00:32:26] But it may also mean that you are good with them.

[00:32:29] My wife and I are good with credit cards and we use them to get rewards and extra money that we can spend on trips and travel and things like that.

[00:32:35] We're good with our credit cards.

[00:32:36] So we are allowed to benefit from those.

[00:32:39] But if you're not good with them, stay away from them.

[00:32:41] It took a while to learn that this was bad advice, but there was some good advice that came from it.

[00:32:44] And that's because we started out with debit card only.

[00:32:47] And that was really good for us.

[00:32:48] It allowed us to realize that we can control our spending together.

[00:32:53] We were able to see our money come out of our account right away.

[00:32:55] That sort of stuff really helped us get started with budgeting together.

[00:32:59] But being able to use credit cards helped us out a lot with managing our spending as well because we were able to save up a ton of points.

[00:33:05] And we honestly saved a ton of money on our trip to Hawaii because these points we had saved up for a long, long time.

[00:33:10] But what's a bad piece of advice that you got from the internet that took you a little bit to realize it was bad?

[00:33:15] Let me know either in the comments on Spotify or send me an email, of course.

[00:33:18] But let's wrap up this episode next.

[00:33:21] I hope you enjoyed today's episode.

[00:33:22] Today we had the opportunity to speak with Hannah Morrell about the impact of social media on financial advice.

[00:33:27] We kicked things off by discussing how social media can lead to FOMO and unrealistic comparisons, which often drive emotionally charged decisions.

[00:33:35] Hannah explained the importance of recognizing this emotional decision-making process and how just taking only 15 seconds and to pause and think about it can make all the difference.

[00:33:44] We also explored how faulty advice spreads so easily through social media and the role of awareness in spotting scams or misleading tips.

[00:33:51] We need to make sure to slow down, be curious, and truly understand if the financial advice is really in our best interest.

[00:33:57] But do remember that social media can be used positively to foster good financial connections and build community,

[00:34:03] just like this community of money buddies, where we're all here to talk about money and do better with money together.

[00:34:08] Remember, there's no correct one way to handle money.

[00:34:11] Financial tools should be simple, and they should focus on what truly works for you.

[00:34:15] Thank you for listening to today's episode.

[00:34:17] The best way to stay up-to-date and connected with all things Money Talk is to sign up for my email list.

[00:34:22] Head over to moneytalkwithskylerfleming.com and submit your name and email right there on the homepage.

[00:34:27] You can also use the contact page on my website to send me any questions or crazy money stories that you might have.

[00:34:31] Remember, the best way to learn from today's episode is to go and have a Money Talk about today's topic.

[00:34:36] Thank you for listening to this week's episode of Money Talk with Skylar Fleming.

[00:34:39] I'm your host, Skylar Fleming. Have a great week.

[00:34:42] Thank you for listening to Money Talk with Skylar Fleming.

[00:34:44] This show is provided for informational and entertainment purposes and may not be specific to your unique situation.

[00:34:51] Please be sure to do additional research before making any financial decisions.

[00:34:55] Thank you.